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ethical timeshare salesforce

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  • ethical timeshare salesforce

    I have just been looking through postings on the different headings across the site it is very clear that Mavo is in favour of an ethical salesforce in the timeshare industry but should we be promoting suicide on such a large scale . They cannot all go back to selling secondhand cars

  • #2
    The reasoning behind my thoughts and posts are very simple really.
    I believe that the concept of timeshare is so good that it could and should have been sold ethically from the very beginning.
    If it had been then it would not find itself in the position it find itself today. Greed at corporate level and also at sales level have played major roles in dragging it down to where it finds itself today.
    There are companies out there who sell timeshare ethically and very successfully and they will appear in our Good Guys category in due course. The industry is not all bad but some of the larger developers are responsible in the main for creating what is bad within the industry. Not only within the industry but they are also mainly responsible for attracting the bad elements that work just outside the industry, preying on those consumers that the big developers refuse to treat in a reasonable and sympathetic manner.


      KEITH HURST commented
      Editing a comment
      As always you make a case that is a valid one bad apple ruins the barrel and if timeshare is ever to be looked on as an ethical product an extensive mind change by both the industry and the public at large. will be needed This will not an overnight event as the very word is viewed with distaste
      Last edited by KEITH HURST; 07-03-2018, 05:25 PM.

  • #3
    You are right Keith there is a hard core of growing timeshare owners that view timeshare with miss taste and thats for a number of reasons. There are folks that should never have had the timeshare in the first place. Some have never been properly educated on best use. Others have a change of lifestyle and maybe unfortunately are with a company that locks them in or has hiked up their maintenance fees.
    The majority though are happy and never search out the internet to find a place where they can put up that they enjoy their timeshare. It would just never happen so we tend to hear mainly about the negatives of timeshare.

    The last independent consumer study that I am aware of that was carried out by Bournemouth University’s School of International Tourism showed that the 35 to 45 year olds who were surveyed about timeshare, had heard nothing negative about the product and believed it represented an interesting and value for money alternative to the average package holiday and wanted to know more about it.

    If they get the product right with good marketing theres whole generations that would be interested in my opinion.
    Last edited by Charlie1; 14-03-2018, 11:49 AM.


    • #4
      I am happy to concede that the basic plan of timeshare is for many people the best thing since sliced bread and I have met many people who would not take any other type of holiday. The study you mentioned has one flaw and that is we are not all between 35 and 45 some of us are between 70 and 80 And by the way I am always interested in your views every coin has two sides
      Last edited by KEITH HURST; 08-03-2018, 07:54 AM.


      • #5
        Thanks Keith for your input - the reason I mentioned the survey was to illustrate that there were whole generations that were not anti-timeshare and were actually curious. Also those students that did the interviewing for the survey obviously got to know more about the concept of timeshare and were very positive about this way of holidaying and said it would be something they could be interested in when older.

        That’s why I said there were whole generations that marketing should be catering for but not using the old timeshare style of approaching and in most cases need to review their timeshare model.

        Timeshare works if applied correctly look at Hapimag they were established over 50 years ago. Not a single complaint on the internet! The resorts are up to a very high standard and they sell!! They have their own home base points systems that’s simple to understand.

        Information I have is that Hapimag is unique in that it has a share buy-back program. All shareholders are allowed to sell their shares back to Hapimag after four years at 82% of its current value (Hapimag charges 18% for administration buy back costs)

        Stats are hard to come by but it has been said there are up to 20,000,000 timeshare owners worldwide. There’s over 9million timeshare owners in the USA alone. The average age of a timeshare owner is 47 in the USA

        There have been surveys showing that the majority are happy with their timeshares. The main problems are timeshare mature owners who may be locked in or have high maintenances.

        In the UK I can find no stats but I bet the average age in the UK is more than 47! Also a high percentage bought abroad and now the mature don’t either want to pay costly flights or have health considerations.

        For the record I have always recommended that timeshare owners buy in the country they reside in. Worst case it’s a tank of petrol and a car ride away.

        The concept of timeshare works BUT in my opinion some timeshare companies got greedy so they put out new products including different types of points systems and members were ‘upgraded’ with higher costs. To my experience some were complicated and ended up expensive if there were members that were not able to use them to suit the way and time of year they wished to holiday.

        The concept of timeshare is proven to work at any age as demonstrated by Hapimag in particular. As Mavo said some timeshare companies need to cut their losses and consider their whole approach and review their product. Keep it simple as folks don't want a degree to understand how it works. Theres a lot of popular resorts that have got it right and we don't see their members complaining – the others have got to catch up!

        Unfortunately the only news were see are those that complain as happy timeshare owners have no need to go on the website to tell the world that timeshare works for them. Same as my car - I'm happy with it and wont put that on the internet. BUT if I got a problem and the manufacture is ignoring me or unhelpful or perhaps over charges me. I might just put that on the internet.
        Last edited by Charlie1; 08-03-2018, 08:46 AM.


        • #6
          About 10 years ago I met with Steve Cloobeck who at that time was the co owner (along with George Soros) of Diamond Resorts. We spoke at some length of the need to address the problem of aging members. My view was and still is that those members over 70 should be allowed to leave unhindered. After a number of years there was a compromise solution offered which was that they could leave at the age of 75. This has spread to other areas of the industry and I understand that being allowed to leave at age 75 is now a mandatory requirement for timeshare users who own with any developer who is a member of RDO. (RDO members are said to represent only around 7% of European timeshare users and could be even less after Silverpoints pulled out)
          The problem comes with the replacing of those aging members who decide to leave timeshare. What the developers have failed to do is to clean up their act regarding sales techniques and to take account of the internet spread of knowledge.
          As charlie 1 points out, it is in general only the negative side of timeshare that we see on the internet and people believe what they read . So if they read little positive then they believe that there is little positive. So then primary selling of timeshare products becomes problematic (by primary selling I mean direct sales via the developers) So we get very few takers to replace those who choose to leave.
          So what if any are the solutions, particularly for those developers whose unethical sales practices are being battered by disclosures on the internet?
          1) Opening up the secondary market is the first and obvious place to start as it bypasses the negativity being generated around primary sales.
          2) The second thing to do is to reinvent sales practices, cut out the lies and pressure selling. Create salaried sales positions only, with performance incentives that are not so big that they push sales teams into going back to the bad old days.
          3) Create realistic exit breaks in contracts similar to leases so that members can leave at a time of their choosing (with sufficient notice being given to the developer)
          4) Simplify products by reverting back to the basic model, then create structures that show members how to get best use from their products.
          *For some developers. 4) May be the most difficult to achieve simply because of the tier systems they have created in recent years. (Valued, Silver, Gold, Platinum, Super Platinum, Super dooper Platinum, Super dooper Platinum with a twist , with a twist plus one etc.etc.)... You get the idea.
          Change is inevitable but the problems are not yet insurmountable it just needs the collective will to change and re-invent the timeshare model.


          • KEITH HURST
            KEITH HURST commented
            Editing a comment
            Tell me more about RDA and the 75 age get out i own in the USA will it apply

        • #7
          There is nothing that I would disagree with but until the industry cleans up its act and stops treating it customers as cash cows things will not change.
          Timeshare is a service industry people do not NEED IT and it has to be something that they buy into because they want it.. Until developers and exchange companies remember that they are not selling a must have product and put service back into there mindset it only get worse I know there are good developers and good exchange ;companies its just a pity its not the norm


          • #8
            Hi Keith
            RDO is a European Developers Organization. The equivalent in the USA is called ARDA (American Resort Development Association) Its President and CEO is Howard C Nusbaum. Tel Washington 202-207-1068 email ... hnusbaum@arda.org